Need hull and engine help please

[The.okie]

Looking for a boat to take out to the lake. The water there can get fairly choppy. What has currently caught my eye is the 64" fountain by bonzi. I did read another thread here where it seems as though the owner was very happy with the boat (beautiful boat btw). The 84" is out of my proposed budget. Does anyone else here have experience with these hulls or any others on choppy water?

Was thinking about ordering the hull rigged minus the engine. For that, I was looking at the gizmo 30 plus (36cc) pro mod with the billet case and their exhaust. From my research, this seems to be better than the bonzi bzx4 setup.

My last contemplation are the adjustable trim tabs from arrowshark. Has anyone used these or know anyone that has? Bonzi seems to think they are a gadget and won't hold up. Due to the drastic changes in the water at the lake, it would be very convenient if they did.

My only other thought is a splitter and running dual props to counter the effects of a single prop on the hull, but that is not a huge deal and not so sure I want to lose the power a splitter would rob.

Top speed is not a huge concern but 50's plus would be ideal. We can't run it wide open all the time, but when the lake is smooth, the speed will be used.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

 

[Rep732]

I take it you read my bonzi boat build thread and it sounds like you didn't read it well enough.. I'm new to boats and my take on it is each hull has pros and cons and each have their own undesirable traits. How big of a boat do you want(style) hull. There are ways of working with a hull to get it perform better and regardless of the hull all of them have to be tuned to conditions as like real boats don't have "fixed" trim tabs. Btw gizmo doesn't make a 36cc engine its just 30.5cc with a +2mm stroker crank. The only way to get the boat to do what you want is to tune it with the trim tabs and different props. Don't get hooked on arrow shark stuff as its overpriced and the stuff that's been used for decades is proven to work but if you want a scale representation of a offshore boat go for the arrowshark stuff but your not gunna have a better boat by buying that stuff


Also stick with a single engine and prop for now to make life easier ... get a gzr engine as they are very good quality

 

[The.okie]

I will have to go back and re-read your thread then.
Hull size, due to the water, bigger is better. Budget, I want to stay under 2500 for the build. Definitely a v-hull as I think anything else would be unstable.
That's why I was hoping the arrowshark electric trim tabs would work. Being able to adjust the trim from the controller, while on the water, would be fantastic.
When I called gizmo, they recommended me to a prop guy. That is who I will use for the prop. Yes, it was the 30 plus pro mod, billet case, gzr crank. At least what engine to run is solved. I did miss the total displacement (mixed it up with one from performance unlimited).
I don't care about being correct to scale. This is just a boat for my son to run alongside my big boat and go play with while we are beached.

 

[Rep732]

Go on bonzi and price out a boat that you want from start to finish. I went with an "RTR" from them but stated I didn't need an engine and the price without an engine and radio cost me $2,040 dollars here's the receipt ...take the price of paint out that was $500.... rc boats are no difference than real ones so staying with a budget is non existent here. And I built an engine that I believe I spent 600 to build

 

[The.okie]

I have spoken with them and gotten a quote. Have also called and spoken with gizmo about the motor and pipe. As long as I'm close to the budget I'm good, just did not want to start out at 3500 for the 84".

My biggest concerns are really the hulls ability to handle rough water and power. Rough meaning probably 8" chop on average. As in, are there better hulls suited for rough water without just annihilating the budget. Bonzi stated low 50's with their bzx4, which makes 6hp. They also stated the fountain was their pick for rough water. The gizmo makes about 7.8hp, wondering if that will get the boat closer to the 60 mark for the calm days.

There seem to be more and more companies I stumble across that build hulls. I don't have all the knowledge or experience to know who builds what. Same goes for engines.

 

[Rep732]

I'll tell you right now if I didn't keep up with bonzi I wouldn't have gotten it as fast as I did. Your minimum wait time is 3+ months if you go with then. It's getting a little outrageous with hp numbers in the rc world take advertised hp numbers for face value and nothing more than an estimate. You need to find a more mellow venue for the boat is you wanna bomb 8" chop that would be like 12 foot swells to a real boat. Gasoline powered rc boats are NOT a plug and play and a no issue deal i have more time in recovering my 2 boats than combined runtime. Point in case I ran my hydro literally 19 seconds total before the prop came out of the water, spun up and came back in the water which then bent my flex shaft and twisting the flexshaft loose of the solder. So don't expect your boat to survive long with jumping scale waves because you will be running a grid pattern with a wreck hook looking for your sunken boat. Also think of flotation because sinking it is a very real thing and the more pool noodles you got the better you'll be of picking up a very wet boat rather than what I mentioned before. Bottom line is here your expectation of this rc boat is higher than what reality is.

 

[The.okie]

It does get smooth. If it's bad, he can run it in behind the boat and I'll crush the waves for him. If it's choppy, the boat will be ran with just enough speed to keep the bow up over the waves.
Ya, saw one say 14hp out of 36cc, had a hard time buying that claim.
We used to race oval for years, some offroad, and ran a couple drag races. Nothing was plug and play if you wanted to be a contender. I expect nothing less with a gas boat. Had a nitro cat years ago (26" I believe), that thing was finicky as well and hated anything but glass.

I'll remember to stay on top of them if I order through there. Was definitely planning on stuffing it full of pool noodles. Also going with the carbon fiber hull for added rigidity. When we raced, we carried multiple spares of everything, will have to figure out the breaking points of the boat and keep spares handy as well.

 

[Rep732]

Good so you get the idea lol. And my fountain doesn't have carbon and I say for the up charge it's just bling and not necessary as the bottom is pretty sturdy and has no flex if you push on it... build a full mod 30.5cc and it will rip and a good prop you'll be set. I will say this bonzi setup my trim tabs and I haven't adjusted them yet. Get a full race exhaust and make sure to do a clutch in the boat as its more user friendly and you can idle and the water pump is excellent to have when going slow or idling...... whats that in the pic? Baja outlaw? And have you watched the video of my fountain running?

 

[The.okie]

My curiosity is how well the fiberglass will hold up in comparison to carbon. Would rather not get a bunch of stress cracks, especially if I have it painted. I did prefer a carbon chassis over the glass chassis on the sprint cars we ran. I kind of have a thing for converting everything to carbon, have 2 old school kyosho mini z's I put full carbon chassis on. I'm leaning towards that direction as I know this boat will take a beating.

Don't really feel like building a motor, I'll just buy one. $540 for a motor that has nothing stock on it seems like a good deal.
https://www.gizmomotors.com/online-store/j-g-36mm-engine-gzr-billet-crankcase-22021

Water pump and clutch were definitely going to be added, if not included.
I need to go back and rewatch. I have watched so many videos I forget who's is who's, but I will later this evening. What is the roughest water you have had yours in?
I'm still super curious if anyone has ran those arrowshark trim tabs, would be awesome if they really worked.

Yes, good eye. It's an 09 26 outlaw built by none other than... fountain. Fountain made quite a few changes to the boat when they built them.

Oh ya, what exhaust are you running? Is that a wet pipe? I see the water cooled coupler, does that end up going out the exhaust or what?

 

[Rep732]

Thanks man I grew up on boats and always admired the go fast boats.

So on to your questions
1. Not sure bonzi offers full carbon,the carbon you see is laid on top of the glass.
2. That j&g engine was a choice I was interested in and looks good
3.bonzi will build you pretty much any boat configuration you want..check out their face book they do have 1 or 2 arrow shark related builds on there.
4. The roughest chop I been in was maybe 2" wind backed ripples really but the fountain doesn't want to fly or blow over so I don't see an issue and you know as well as I do the front of the fountain the way its shaped it won't take water over the bow as long as it's not taller than it lol.
5. The exhaust is the bonzi race exhaust and no its not wet tuned the exhaust is dry and the pipe does get hot. The coupler is there to I guess help cool that area of the header so it doesn't melt the o-rings to connect the pipe to the header
6. I highly advise getting the boat painted as I was not thrilled with the way the gelcoat looked and thats why I was forced to wrap the boat. Super thin gelcoat and not 100% the best attention to detail with applying the gelcoat in the mold....my grandfather did fiberglass for over 40 years I've seen him do it.

 

[The.okie]

I watched yours again, it does run really well. I'm definitely a fan of your attention to detail, had not yet mentioned that. Nice work!

Real boats are just another toy. I still drool over them and will upgrade again one day. Have not yet decided to what though. Think you need one to provide companionship for the rc's.

1) if that's how they do it, I'm very disappointed. I'll pay the money for a full carbon hull, not an overlay. That is definitely a question they will be asked.
2) sounds like the engine area is on the correct path
3) they had no idea those tabs even existed and told me "there is no way the motors in those things provide enough torque to move/hold them on the water". At $250, I kind of want someone else to be the guinea pig.
4) 2" is a good start and promising in the boat not being phased by it. The "beak" does work, and also provides a lot of controversy for overall length lol.
5) was I completely mistaken that it had a water cooled coupler? Exhaust temp is not much of a concern, more worried about a proper cooling system. I wonder how much difference there is in the exhausts. Did you run yours as is or did you experiment with head pipe length into the expansion chamber? Gizmo is $60 cheaper on their full exhaust (water cooled flange, or maybe it warms the water to the head)
6) was just going to have bonzi paint it to match the outlaw. I would hope their paint work is better than their gel coat then. Otherwise, I have almost no knowledge with fiberglass as I have only worked with it once, then end result turned out great once smoothed with bondo just made some a-pillars to hold tweeters.

How much run time are you getting out of your battery? Running a lipo I assume? How many mah?