tempering

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rc tommy

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I run one tank of fuel. that gear wore out and the dogbone cup broken . after that I tempered it for 15 mins. now it look red. is it over tempered ? :eek: :rolleyes:


I wonder how long shall I temper that gear and the dogbone cup and what is the best temperture degree in c ?


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the gears are a waste of time. i gave up on them.


i would try the other recipes with plastic gears and vented cover.
 
I'm not following why the meatal gears need tempering ???


I've had metal gears on my FG for ages and they are still in good working order, even after i broke a upper rear arm that allowed the dogbone to jump out of position and straight into the spur gear it only rounded a couple of teeth very slightly but nothing that affects it's running.


What do you guys use to temper the shafts ??


heat gun?


blow torch / lamp ?


Cheers
 
I agree with GRF. I gave up on the metal gears and went with plastic. I just keep them well lubricated with 120,000 diff fluid. It sticks really well. As far as the diff cups go, it is an ONGOING problem with the MT. It is the weak link that many owner struggle with. See the post: http://www.redcatrampageforum.com/showthread.php?t=2763


We all hope a fix for the diff cups happens. I keep breaking them exactly as you have pictured in your post. Other than the cups, it is a very fun truck. Hang in there.
 
I use the metal gears and have no problems. I also tempered them to a bluish grey. I also tempered the drive cups to a bluish grey. Still broke a couple. I used a propane torch.
 
tempering the gears is the worse thing that you can do to them. they will become softer than they already are and as a result they will become scrap even faster. out of 4 gears i got only one was what supposed to be. so i guess some might get a good set some not. if you do not get a correct set from the beginning do not bother with them. just replace what you need with plastic.
 
To hard of metal makes it brittle, to soft it will ripp somewhere in between is what you want.


Tempering the metal helps maintain its elasticity the ones we get are to hard.


Mine are tempered and have not broke nothing and I run a ported stroker engine.


I had mine tempered at a professional heat treat shop . The home brew torch way takes a little practice and control to keep the temper consistant. I feel that is what some are dealing with.
 
Honestly, I'm tired of having to f**k with some of these BS fixes. That being said, I enjoy running it a lot so I guess I'll be doing the BS fixes until some upgrades are available!


Additionally, I found the tempering on my gears to work just fine and have many tanks on them without wear. I guess we can disagree on what works and what doesn't work until the cows come home (mooooooo!). :)
 
Martin said:
The only way to make gear better is to case hardened them, so try to tempered a gear will only accelerate the wear.
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That may be true, but in my case, I've yet to see any wear. Maybe I didn't get them hot enough to make any difference, I don't know. Maybe there was nothing wrong with mine. I don't know.


rc-driver didn't do anything to his gear, temper it or anything until after his first run. So since it's messed up, I don't think he runs really any risk with tempering since it already appears chewed.
 
csp1971 said:
That may be true, but in my case, I've yet to see any wear. Maybe I didn't get them hot enough to make any difference, I don't know. Maybe there was nothing wrong with mine. I don't know.
rc-driver didn't do anything to his gear, temper it or anything until after his first run. So since it's messed up, I don't think he runs really any risk with tempering since it already appears chewed.
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My Rampage gear mesh was terrible at the center diff and the gear plate when I got my truck.


Instead of running the dog out of it and grennading the gears then posting complaints because it didn't live. I shimmed all the gears and made them all happy with the mesh and took all the thrust endplay out of the center diff gear.


I have had NO gear issues and I am running a race ported stroker beast of a motor.


I feel that if you don't consider this vehicle a RTR and check over the car well before you gas and go most of you wouldn't be having the issues you all are posting about. Poor gear mesh and to much end play leads to premature gear wear and breakage.
 
Sprint77- on the B/C gear shaft, I have to keep the nut a little bit loose, otherwise the gears don't rotate smoothly. I've had good luck doing that. Did you have to do anything with shimming on that shaft?


Did you do anything special with that two piece shaft for shimming (center diff)? Mine seems pretty good, but if there is some way to make it better without the play, I'm all for it.
 
csp1971 I made a spacer for the lay shaft to give it more support and help it run concentric . I also wicked green loctite 620 into spacer on final assembly.


If you can move the lay shaft any in and out end play wise it is hard on the center diff mesh. Get it all out without binding the shaft.


Next I went to the center diff and shimmed the bearings with some shims I got from Mcmaster car ( they are plastic and diffeent colors for different thickness) I again took all the end play out of this without it binding.


I checked this outside the car with the center diff boted to the upper brace and bolted to the gear plate. This speeds up the choices and lets yo feel how it works.


After I got it like I wanted I broke the gears in together on the table with the gear plate attached with a cordless drill.


I can have my truck brake off wheels off ground grab the center dogbone at small shaft twist and turn all four wheels with ease.


Hope that helps some of you all out. As I said I have had ZERO gear , diff , or dogbone failures.
 
Great info Sprint. I'm going to check mine out again and do it like that with it unbolted from the chassis. Sounds smooth!
 
i already have something on the works about those gears.


in my case i am sure that play and alignment had nothing to do with it. the 2 25t and the 31t were just wrong. the 25s were out of center and that was checked on a lathe with new squares and also custom ones and the 31 was on the clutch bell. the 29 is like new and the 31 does not exist any more. if i had any alignment problems i would have at least some damage on the 29 too. i bought them from ddm with the car so i do not know if they are hsp or himoto or something else. the funny things about breaking in the gears although i do not believe in them (if a gear wears it looses the case hardening and involute shape and that is the end of it) i followed them just in case to make sure that i did not stuff them up. if the gears were good they would have destroyed the bearings or the carier or the d shaft or something else too (it has happened to me with another rc).
 
Martin said:
Apparently there is no premature wear with steel gear on Rampage, but if for any given reason someone have issue and need a real steel case hardened gear, you have to look here:
http://www.gotpetrol.net/steel-gears-vt4838.html


He have more gearing ratio available than the factory.
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Yey !!!!!!!!!!!


There what i've got on my FG and they are indestructable - hold up to everything i've asked of them and im hard.... very hard on my rc's.


British made cant beat it :D .................. not that im biased ;)
 
grf said:
..........(if a gear wears it looses the case hardening and involute shape and that is the end of it) .......
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Absolutely true.


mini the minx: I also got the 2 speed steel FG from him the last summer, and those gear are bomb proof.
 
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