bit of advice on sommat please,

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spents

spents

Uncle Fester👻
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can anyone please tell me the diameter of the kraken outdrive on the telescopic rear shaft ?
i mean inside diameter of the hole that slips over the diff pinion,
reason being (long ass post alert :ROFLMAO:) i have plans for a one off build, its been in my head for a few years now and is sommat i really want to attempt,
the build is basically a 1/5 scale rock bouncer/racer, think screamin blue and bobby tanner,
anyways, i was gonna buy a new v2 dragon hammer roller and use that as a doner car, then use owt left over as spares for my obr twin dragon hammer ,
been speaking to rcmodelz and they have no idea when the hammer rollers are comin back into stock, they cant get much info on anything from fid factory,
so i've gathered a few bits n bobs, set of kraken maxxis tires, heim joints etc,
and now , unless i bide my time and wait to see if the hammers come back into stock (they been outa stock since october time),
it looks like i may need to do a mix n match build, i don't really wanna buy a kraken and break it up for the build,
so as above, the diameter of the kraken drive please (y),
then i can see if i can mix n match with a 30 degree truck diff pinions and drive parts etc,
even those are outa stock in uk at moment though, only other option is a losi 5ive t at £1600, or rovan lt360 for cheapness,
chassis wise is gonna be a one off tube chassis/ cage , and solid/live axles both front and rear,
as much home made as possible with exception of diffs, sliding drive shafts etc etc,
end of long ass post :ROFLMAO:
 
dougstar said:
Getting steering off a solid front axle will be a PITA? Unless you make it from scratch ? ........think big and buy raminator axles and a 80/85 powerhouse ?????
Click to expand...
yeh i know doug (y)(y), thats the point of the build tbh though, make my own axles, or use hammer rear sentres and build around em :D(y),
long term build and hard as feck to get right, loadsa trial and error an stuff :LOL:,
raminator too big n heavy for what i wanna do,
want to try and build a lightweight (ish) screamin blue style rock bouncer/racer cos there aint one out there at moment in 1/5 scale,
this idea been in my head for a few years now an its just sommat i wanna attempt (y),
mega problems to solve i know , but thats the point of it :),

was hopin lance woulda seen this and given the kraken vekta rear outdrive bore off the top of his head :LOL:,
 
dougstar said:
Could always stick to independent front end and still achieve the same goal like this ??????
Click to expand...
yeh could do the independant front doug (y),
but idea was always twin live axles and get it to work without too much torque twist etc,
plans can always change though :LOL:,
also wanted to do a full build thread on here and include all the balls ups i make as well as the successes :),
and get as much member advice and suggestions as i can,
i been reading up on suspension geometry as well,
frame/chassis will be welded, so will need to improve my welds an all :ROFLMAO:
 
Spents don't listen to the haters (doug). Go the solid axle route, I've seen plenty of your one off builds. You got the patience and ambition to get it done. There are several companies that make solid axles, but I'm unsure if they make axles being enough for 1/5 scale. Making the front axle steer wouldnt be the hardest bit imo. Bit of fabbing and retrofitting cv axles, bob the solid axle down, could be modeled fairly solidly off a 1:1 axles, just with cv as the u joint to keep it from binding, and allow greater steer angle. The rest should be a cake walk for ye. Next biggest hurtle I think you'll have is getting the right drive shafts, that can compress and extend the right amount, in conjunction with getting long travel suspension set to a neutral position. Another thought is having the engine as low as possible and centered as much as possi to get a centered weight bias, and keep the center of gravity as low as you can. In real life these thing go from rock crawling to jumping and bouncing off rocks all on the same course. So they need to be very forgiving to do either task. I'll keep a look out for ideas to send your way, I think it should be a fantastic project once completed. Or you know you can will it and the dragon hammer to me ??
don't know if something like this would work,
https://store.rc4wd.com/Burnout-14-Scale-Axle_p_3999.html
 
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Seandonato73 said:
Spents don't listen to the haters (doug). Go the solid axle route, I've seen plenty of your one off builds. You got the patience and ambition to get it done. There are several companies that make solid axles, but I'm unsure if they make axles being enough for 1/5 scale. Making the front axle steer wouldnt be the hardest bit imo. Bit of fabbing and retrofitting cv axles, bob the solid axle down, could be modeled fairly solidly off a 1:1 axles, just with cv as the u joint to keep it from binding, and allow greater steer angle. The rest should be a cake walk for ye. Next biggest hurtle I think you'll have is getting the right drive shafts, that can compress and extend the right amount, in conjunction with getting long travel suspension set to a neutral position. Another thought is having the engine as low as possible and centered as much as possi to get a centered weight bias, and keep the center of gravity as low as you can. In real life these thing go from rock crawling to jumping and bouncing off rocks all on the same course. So they need to be very forgiving to do either task. I'll keep a look out for ideas to send your way, I think it should be a fantastic project once completed. Or you know you can will it and the dragon hammer to me ??
don't know if something like this would work,
https://store.rc4wd.com/Burnout-14-Scale-Axle_p_3999.html
Click to expand...
lmao sean, nah i get what doug meant with the difficulty of making steering work on a solid axle an that, so i don't take his comment as a hater comment (y),
and thanks for the above post an all sean (y), this is the type of stuff i wanna see,
also if anyone sees me making a balls up of owt, then constructive criticism is always welcome, as i said, the builds gonna be a total one off trial and error till i get it right, i don't wanna make a shelf queen, i want it to work. and work as well as possible (y),
it aint sommat i just decided to do is what i mean, i've been thinking about this build for years,
four link front and rear, open front and rear diffs, locked centre with transfer case ,
i want to try and get the front and rear centre shafts turning in opposite directions with offset diff in the front at least to try and minimise torque twist if that makes sense, so flipped diff in the front to keep all four wheels driving the right direction but centre shafts rotating in opposites to each other,
and also gonna need 8 degree or so of castor on front axle etc etc, weight of axles i don't want too heavy , but also needs weight there to help with stability, unsprung weight,also probably servo on axle for steering, which again theres the issue of making a servo save compact enough etc etc,
i just love making stuff as much as driving em rc wise, and i like solving problems to make stuff work,
and yeh hopefully it turns out really well, not gonna start the actual build till i get some driveline stuff worked out and bought though,
which was the plan as said in original post, dragon hammer based, but seems covid and brexit happening no one has stock of anything in the uk, at least not the parts i need/want, hopefully things return to normal soon though and stock levels increase here,
thanks for that link as well sean (y), but want to make as many parts myself as i can, but interesting that rc4wd are doing those now,

anyone any idea of the original question as well ? bore of the outdrive on the vekta rear sliding shaft i mean :LOL:,

not sure how many people know the tires i'm gonna use, heres a pic though of the kraken maxxis trepadors i'm gonna be using,
trepador next to dragon hammer truck size tire and baja front,

 
I don't run servo savers on my rock crawler. Even if I swap the high speed gears in. No room for one on the axle. If your using the kraken rears. You'll have to make your own tubes for the front axle, and tbh I don't think torque twist would be a major issue either way. I also think counter rotating shafts arnt going to work out too well, you'll need some sort of reverser for one of the shafts, and that will just muddy the water in the drive train. Again not really an issue with a smaller crawler. Shouldnt be a issue with a 1/5 scale either. (Imo)
 
Spents, for steering why not hydraulic rams from RC diggers etc, they can be made to work quick enough and will be more than strong enough for your application plus you can put the manifold/pump etc centre chassis for weight distribution, also means could go rear steer too easily.

I was watching RCSparks recently and he has just done a couple of little skid steers that run hydraulic pumps etc and they seemed pretty quick, he had to turn down the pump IIRC
 
Seandonato73 said:
I don't run servo savers on my rock crawler. Even if I swap the high speed gears in. No room for one on the axle. If your using the kraken rears. You'll have to make your own tubes for the front axle, and tbh I don't think torque twist would be a major issue either way. I also think counter rotating shafts arnt going to work out too well, you'll need some sort of reverser for one of the shafts, and that will just muddy the water in the drive train. Again not really an issue with a smaller crawler. Shouldnt be a issue with a 1/5 scale either. (Imo)
Click to expand...
i may try saver less then sean and see what happens (y):D,
tbh its gonna be builts to be on the faster side , not really a crawler but a rock bouncer/racer type of build,
and yeh making my own axles/tubes was the plan, built in multiple parts then assembled , complicated yes, but have a partial plan in my head , well i have a few plans in my head :ROFLMAO:,
the counter rotating shafts i've seen used on full sized bouncers to help with the twist sean,
maybe i'm over complicating my ideas though, the main reason i have a bit of an obsession with eliminating any torque twist is my experiance with the dragon hammer, with the twin in there it twists heavily under full throttle, like one front wheel in the air and counter steering to keep it running straight cos the remaining wheel on the ground is still driving and trying to steer the car,
hammer has centre diff so front and rear drive are turning same direction,
my idea for counter rotating shafts is transfer case with drive from spur running to rear, then a two gears, one on the rear drive and one on the front drive which will reverse the front shaft rotation, as long as the gears are the same size then shafts will rotate different directions but at the same speed, i think :LOL:,
and the gears will be built into a home made transfer case,
i need to have a closer look at the vekta setup tbh though cos that has an idler gear in there plus a slipper from what i gather, also the vekta doesn't have a centre diff, and from what i've seen doesn't suffer from the whole one wheel in the air twist at the front end,
keep any ideas coming cos its all being taken in and considered (y)(y)
KevTrem said:
Spents, for steering why not hydraulic rams from RC diggers etc, they can be made to work quick enough and will be more than strong enough for your application plus you can put the manifold/pump etc centre chassis for weight distribution, also means could go rear steer too easily.

I was watching RCSparks recently and he has just done a couple of little skid steers that run hydraulic pumps etc and they seemed pretty quick, he had to turn down the pump IIRC
Click to expand...
yeh had the discussion with somone else about the hydraulic steering kev (y) ,
problem is the weight of the system, i'm trying to keep weight to a minimum so hydraulic steerings ganna add a load,
i was gonna attempt to make my own setup, but without high pressure, two way ram on the axle then twin rams on the chassis and just use a servo to work back and forth, sealed system so unless theres a leak then ram should return to centre when servo returns,
but had a proper think about that and getting a home made system to self centre was gonna be unreliable,
and a full on rc pumped system would just add too much weight i think, i have seen some of rc sparks vids, gonna revisit some of em and have another think (y),
thanks though kev (y)(y)
Milo said:
Looking forward to seeing this. ??
Click to expand...
i'm looking forward to starting to build it miles (y) (y)
 
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Few thing mate, hydro steering count be kept light and a pump wouldnt really be needed. I've seen some closed loop systems that use a ram connected to another ram. Well actually it was 2 single action rams connected to a double acting ram. No pump. You basically has a steering wheel connected via a lever to the 2 single acting rams, when turned they pushed the fluid into the double acting ram, turning the buggy. It worked about like a normal steering system, just a bit to get used to as you didnt have a full turn to get from lock to lock. Basically have a servo set up and the wheel and servo arm as the lever. Would take a bit to figure out the right geometry. Prolly more a pain then it's worth. Servos are tougher then we give them credit.
I'll have to get a vid of my rock crawler with the high gears in it and 4s. It rips pretty good, and think size wise it a decent representation of what your looking to do. Although I do like the idea of the counter rotator, i still don't think it will be necessary. May be wrong. Think that will be very dependent on the engine chosen for use, gotta remember the 1:1 guys do t all have super charged nitrous breathing dragons powering there rigs lol.
 
Seandonato73 said:
Few thing mate, hydro steering count be kept light and a pump wouldnt really be needed. I've seen some closed loop systems that use a ram connected to another ram. Well actually it was 2 single action rams connected to a double acting ram. No pump. You basically has a steering wheel connected via a lever to the 2 single acting rams, when turned they pushed the fluid into the double acting ram, turning the buggy. It worked about like a normal steering system, just a bit to get used to as you didnt have a full turn to get from lock to lock. Basically have a servo set up and the wheel and servo arm as the lever. Would take a bit to figure out the right geometry. Prolly more a pain then it's worth. Servos are tougher then we give them credit.
I'll have to get a vid of my rock crawler with the high gears in it and 4s. It rips pretty good, and think size wise it a decent representation of what your looking to do. Although I do like the idea of the counter rotator, i still don't think it will be necessary. May be wrong. Think that will be very dependent on the engine chosen for use, gotta remember the 1:1 guys do t all have super charged nitrous breathing dragons powering there rigs lol.
Click to expand...
yeh the hydro steering i agreed with ya in last post sean , sealed system rams, servo etc (y)(y), ya musta missed that bit :),
i did work out that to get lock to lock a hydro system would need around 30mm of throw each way to get decent lock, or same lock as the dragon hammer,am leaning towards servo on axle tbh though when all said and done, just the one servo wire to protect and route rather than two hydro lines (y)
as said before though, a lot of this builds gonna be trial and error at first, a lot of what i'm gonna try is unknown to me, or i only know basics about some of it, i like to learn new stuff hence this thread, i know this thread i started as just wanting the hole size of the vektaoutdrive, but may as well use it for anyone with an intrest to throw ideas in to give me more ideas on stuff (y)(y),
defo find the vid of yer crawler sean and post up please (y),
power wise was gonna be the rovan/zelda/spovan 45 , buuuuuut, if i can get enough cash together it may change to rcmax powered, either a gt40 or a supreme 55 i was thinking, lot of cash to spend on an engine though :LOL:
 
Best I could do mate. Just on 2s atm. Realized I sent my last 4s when I sold off my 450 heli.
Should make some jumpers for it, motor and esc are rated to 6s, now that makes her twist bad. Habit to find the other gear set as well.
 
Seandonato73 said:
Yeah mate, the power plant will dictate if you need the reverse rotation or not imo. More power more propensity to want to twist.
Click to expand...
yeh thats what i was thinking sean (y),
and the more i think about it the more i wanna put a bigger , better engine in it,
the zelda/spovan 45 is a curiosity engine to see what i can do with it and may just stay in the baja i built up for testing, or used as a dorrstop if its total wank :ROFLMAO:,
all depends on funding as well, if i can get enough money together to get an rcmax :),
thanks for posting the vid as well(y),
i have a yeti xl that runs 6s, and that twists a fair bit as well,
this bouncer racer style build will be geared for fast running :D,
 
Yeah it's not bad on 2s. 4s and 6s are equally exaggerated more. I'll dig around and get some jumpers made up. Big difference on more power. Well and one thing to remember these spring amd shocks are super soft as well. Think it's got 10 at. Oil in them. All about flex suspension with it.
Oh and since you have a yeti I'd assume the steer serves are set up much the same? Would work for your project as well. Would ne nice if it sat down next to the chunk. Keep the weight down lower a bit.
 

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Seandonato73 said:
Yeah it's not bad on 2s. 4s and 6s are equally exaggerated more. I'll dig around and get some jumpers made up. Big difference on more power. Well and one thing to remember these spring amd shocks are super soft as well. Think it's got 10 at. Oil in them. All about flex suspension with it.
Oh and since you have a yeti I'd assume the steer serves are set up much the same? Would work for your project as well. Would ne nice if it sat down next to the chunk. Keep the weight down lower a bit.
Click to expand...
yeh the shocks/springs i was gonna use baja i-rc big bore sean, and maybe the i-rc black stiffer springs as well depending on finished weight of the car,
anti roll bars is another thing an all, thats gonna be totally trial and error cos i don't think theres a stiff enough one out there, i do have an idea to double up anti roll bars though, thats a ways off anyway :LOL:,
the yeti xl has independant front sean, so steering setup is same as anything out there really more losi style,
but yeh sommat similar to whats in yer pic is what i was thinking (y),
 
Ah yeah ok, didnt know the yeti was ifs.... and I doubt you'll be keeping sway bars on if your doing a rock racer. Axle needs to move unimpeded. I'll try to get some pics for ya. We had the king of hammers event up at rousch creek few years back. Basically what your trying to make in scale. Think it will be some inspirations for ye??
Here you are mate, some viewing material for ya ??
https://youtube.com/c/Ultra4RacingAction
 
Seandonato73 said:
Ah yeah ok, didnt know the yeti was ifs.... and I doubt you'll be keeping sway bars on if your doing a rock racer. Axle needs to move unimpeded. I'll try to get some pics for ya. We had the king of hammers event up at rousch creek few years back. Basically what your trying to make in scale. Think it will be some inspirations for ye??
Here you are mate, some viewing material for ya ??
https://youtube.com/c/Ultra4RacingAction
Click to expand...
thanks for the link sean (y) ,
and yeh bit of an explanation , the build will probably be used on the flat more than rocks sean, thats my thinking with the sway bars, but also would like to try and make it so sway bars can be softened easily to get the articulation without removing em,
not sure if thats possible yet but gonna see if i can think of a way ,
 
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