Cant believe the pettiness of some people

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I think every time we debate the HPI vs Clone it all comes back to HPI.
If HPI would just publish some information publicly on what these clone companies have done or stolen at least there would be some proof that HPI is not just selling parts to keep making a profit. Which IMO would be a very good business decision for HPI and would not be something you would want the public to know.

Just a thought.;)
 
Bigger the Better said:
I think every time we debate the HPI vs Clone it all comes back to HPI.
If HPI would just publish some information publicly on what these clone companies have done or stolen at least there would be some proof that HPI is not just selling parts to keep making a profit. Which IMO would be a very good business decision for HPI and would not be something you would want the public to know.

Just a thought.;)
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In the pharmaceutical business its very probable that the originating patent holder will also make the generic drug version once it goes off patent.

I don't see that happening here with HPI. The baja's havn't been on the market long enough to fully benefit from that activity. Nor would they have any reason to hide the fact.

I also don't see them investing millions into tooling a completely different factory in a different country than their main manfucturing areas. They don't sell enough baja's to make that cost effective.

Now if they were selling millions of units this would be a different story. But they are nowhere near that number.

But it's not just about HPI it's about the other peoples products that have been stolen. I gave an example of such an occurence with the Counterfit Hostile Racing Tires. If Hostile loses 100 unit sales a month do you really think Hostile is going to invest much more money or time making molds for new tire designs?

All innovation and new aftermarket products and designs have been done by people such as Hostile Racing Products. If the counterfit items aren't stopped people like Hostile won't remain in business and won't be able to keep bringing us new products. I havn't seen 1 single innovative design or product come from KM all I have seen are copies of products or concepts which already existed.
 
THey do have a few bodys that just explode pretty damm cool looking on hard impacts lololololo Just saying km has something the others don't:lol:
 
This is to all the clone haters. This is a clone thread,people want to talk about their cars without getting slagged off.You are posting in a 'CLONE' thread! If you don't like what you hear stay in the HPI thread and leave the people with clones alone!
There is a forum called HBF,that is a genuine HPI forum and they will not tolerate clones cars so there will be no one to argue with there.

J.:rolleyes:
 
voo2doo said:
OK,the argument here is that KM are ripping HPI off....right??? So why would HPI put a rebadged CY engine in their cars,which is a copy of the original Zenoah!
Plus they bought out the Maverick blackout or something which IS a Redcat Rampage with a HPI sticker on it!!!!
Who's cloning who here??? You can do this clone war forever and a day and you will be going around in circles.....there will be NO winners! And ,if you look round your house there will defiantly be a copy of an original item there.
J.
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Voo
You need to get your facts straight.The CY and the Zenoah were both designed by the same guy, how can a guy steal his own design?

This was posted on another forum by Vertigo Performance.
"Word I got from the US Sales rep for Zen is CY is a clone yet technically not.. The designer of the Zen moved over to China and made the engine under the CY name.. So the debate should be who really owns the rights to the design (IMHO)"

"Originally Posted by voo2doo
Thats a Redcat rampage MT! Who's doing the cloning here?

Originally Posted by miniripper@mmr
J.
It's not a clone as the Redcat is not an original product. The original model is made by The same people who make the Redcat. They just don't sell it themselves and rather others rebrand it. "

That last one is about 9 months old. It says Redcat doesn't actually make that product. It's made by a third party who ONLY sells it to other companies who then resell it to the public as their own product. Both Redcat and HPI buy this from the same company, probablly with their own stickers already on it, and then sell it to the public. How can it be a clone if the guys who make it are getting paid? The whole arguement here is with the illegal sales of copywritten products, and the items you complain about do not fit this arguement. They are legitimate copies, not outright theft as you claim they are. It is perfectly legal to copy copywritten products IF you have an agreement with the people who have the copyright. Next you'll claim Caroll Shelby was a clone manufacturer.:lol:

I personally have nothing against the people who run clones, except that there aren't any around here who've met up with me for some fun. I can't hold that against them because none of the HPI owners have come out to play either.
 
hansshanks said:
moral of the story. cheap crap and cheap price is still cheap crap. jsu tmore people are willing to take a chance on it. i bought km baja-ish because after doing my research i realized about the only thing on it that i would leave stock was teh reciever box and teh motor. so i saved my money to buy all the aftermarket parts from teh little guys. and i am lgad i did. i have easily spent 3 times the original purchase price in upgrades from places like DDM and TGN. and i still believe that HPI has a hand in all this cone stuff. like they are leaseing out there molds or something to that efffect. when i buy parts i try to buy the made in usa stuff if possible.
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well i personally bought teh hpi baja 5bss and i am wishing i would have sacved teh bucks and bought a KM or rovan, i have spend over 2k in aftermarket parts replacing broken parts and i may have a total of 1.5 hours run time on mine including engine break in, hpi just thinks i am full of it well i am going to fix that i am going to take a large number of pics including my box, manual, and the car along with get the info of my orders from DDM including dates and amount spent and then going to send a copy to hpi via e-mail (i will keep another just in case i need it ;) )
 
You never hear FG or their customers banging on about the Carson Attack which is virtually identical to the Marder and was out way before the KM arrived on the scene upsetting HPI. There was also a thread on here recently about a company selling a MT virtually identical to the FG MT but again no clone arguements. The comments were more complimentary along the lines of if its anything like the FG MT it will be fantastic. There is definitely bitterness amongst the HPI faithful and as BtB pointed out, it would be very interesting to see exactly where HPI stand on all of this and not just heresay.

The KM is fantastic and is definitely hitting the spot with the consumers which is what business is all about. I would like to see the supposed copyright for any 5th. I doubt you will find 1 - after all its a model car copy of the baja 1:1 vehicle!!

Can you imagine in court........Im sorry Sir you are strictly forbidden from making a working scale model of that real life vehicle......only HPI can do that :lol::lol::lol::lol: They will be sueing Roffchopper next for making his own sandrails :lol::lol::lol::lol:
 
it was mentioned above, but i had heard tho, that hpi main production IS overseas, and that theres a US branch here in the usa that makes them for here to save the shiping costs of overseas shipping. so, to say, as above, that hpi is only usa i think is misleading statement. they are overseas as well.

and also as i stated once before, all my aftermarket parts ii bought are usually all hpi parts, so my truck is a half and half KM and HPI parts, with a lil other parts like some DDM stuff, etc... thrown in there as well. i got stuff from tulare, DDM, hpi, a mix of parts on my baja now. for me, buying the KM to start with allowed me the extra i wooda spent on hpi straight away, to spend on upgrades i wooda had to do and spent 400 to 500 more bucks on a hpi. and as experienced by LR above, he got a lemon HPI baja. so lemons can be on both sides of the fence, not just a cloner.

and as VD said also, if you come to a clone thread to bash us , then you should keep to your own and stay the heck outta here, a thread for us, you got your own thread so stay in it, and quit stirring up trouble where ya don't have anything constructive to contribute.
 
Lan-Ed-Tul said:
it was mentioned above, but i had heard tho, that hpi main production IS overseas, and that theres a US branch here in the usa that makes them for here to save the shiping costs of overseas shipping. so, to say, as above, that hpi is only usa i think is misleading statement. they are overseas as well.

and also as i stated once before, all my aftermarket parts ii bought are usually all hpi parts, so my truck is a half and half KM and HPI parts, with a lil other parts like some DDM stuff, etc... thrown in there as well. i got stuff from tulare, DDM, hpi, a mix of parts on my baja now. for me, buying the KM to start with allowed me the extra i wooda spent on hpi straight away, to spend on upgrades i wooda had to do and spent 400 to 500 more bucks on a hpi. and as experienced by LR above, he got a lemon HPI baja. so lemons can be on both sides of the fence, not just a cloner.

and as VD said also, if you come to a clone thread to bash us , then you should keep to your own and stay the heck outta here, a thread for us, you got your own thread so stay in it, and quit stirring up trouble where ya don't have anything constructive to contribute.
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Show me where anyone is bashing anyone with what has been said in this thread?
This thread was about an ebay listing and why it was removed. I have given example after example as to the reasons and problems with selling counterfit items. Obviously Ebay felt strongly enough about it based on the fact that they removed the listing. Ebay doesn't do that with a simple email complaing, it requires masses of information being sent by the originator of the designer.

A question was asked and answers were given. Information pertaining to the problem was also given. I did not make this an HPI vs KM debate I am talking about counterfit Aftermarket items.

A forums sole purpose is to educate people on the products they wish to buy giving accurate complete information.

I gave a second example of the blatent counterfitting of another well known product. To show how common place this is becoming.

KM is Hpi's problem, Counterfit aftermarket parts are everyones problem If you buy them you are a theif no better than the person who stole the designs. You are taking money from someones pocket. It's no different than buying a stolen stereo off the street. Someone is getting ripped off.

People come to forums seeking advice they should have all the information not have the information hidden or removed. They should know the facts surrounding the counterfit items to make better choices when they go to buy something.

Counterfit not Clone! Keep it straight!
 
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well, you mentioned almost every post how km is basically a counterfeiter, this thread is about km and us who own them so your calling us various names more or less because we bought them, and supported the so called counterfeiter, even tho most of us have BOUGHT hpi parts for upgrades.

if thats not bashing, then i don't know what else is.
 
this clone v's hpi and who's rippin who off is gettin borin now! the guys buyin the clones aren't stupid they know they're are buyin copies of the hpi baja and buy them because they probably can't afford £1000+ to buy hpi, we don't need educatin about the fact every time someone puts a thread up about them, ffs this is 2011 and clonin/counterfittin is part and parcel of every day livin now weather right or wrong there is a market out there for them and it isn't guna change any time soon, hpi die hards have your opinion on the matter and others have theres so can we give it a rest now?????????????? like the mods have said this is a clone section of lsf so if you want to go and female dog about them can you please do it on the other well known forum that don't like clones!

mods can you LOCK THE THREAD or remove it please?????????
 
i can solve this very simply,
if hpi really gave a f**k about KM copying there designs why have they not been stopped, there is almost certainly cash going under the table from km to hpi, i bought a hpi as i had the means given to me, most peole cant go blow 2k just like that km hpi same thing just diffrent names, one has slightly cheaper bits the other is expensive as its built to strict standards hpi can sell at that price as they have a reputation for being strong reliable theyve made there moneys worth! km could never sell at hpi prices as they don't have the rep & besides everything is made in china, hpi is probably over there to right next to km hq

its a consumer choice clone or the real deal, you cant stop that, if one does something differnt that the other likes there bound to copy each other!
sure youre bound to get slated by avid real deal lovers, but who gives a slit, youre enjoying it? then thats what matters end of the day people mocking you for having fun & enjoying yourself with a clone, is all that matters! & pleasure toys are clones of each other now don't you feel dirty

now if you don't mind im going to go & have TESCO VALUE KETCHUP & TESCO VALUE WAFFELS
 
HPI guy's give it a rest this is a king motor thread... KM guy's don't be so harsh on the
HPI guy's :lol: so both of you shut up :lol:
 
don't see the problem, it keeps everyone on their toes and i enjoy the comparisons with all of them.
Would like to see an out of the box just run in race off with all evenly matched brands, maybe a 24 hour job.
 
yeah this is getting boring and tedious... if the 5B design is truely "theirs", then i should imagine HPI would have stopped other companies producing the same buggy a long time ago, or even stop them from the out set. perhaps the desinger owns the rights and patent to it??
 
How is it that the "clones" sometimes come out with a new solution before the real brand do? Could the clones be made at the same factory, designed by the same designers and then sold as a lisenced no brand?
 
upDUHcreek said:
Voo
You need to get your facts straight.The CY and the Zenoah were both designed by the same guy, how can a guy steal his own design?

This was posted on another forum by Vertigo Performance.
"Word I got from the US Sales rep for Zen is CY is a clone yet technically not.. The designer of the Zen moved over to China and made the engine under the CY name.. So the debate should be who really owns the rights to the design (IMHO)"

"Originally Posted by voo2doo
Thats a Redcat rampage MT! Who's doing the cloning here?

Originally Posted by miniripper@mmr
J.
It's not a clone as the Redcat is not an original product. The original model is made by The same people who make the Redcat. They just don't sell it themselves and rather others rebrand it. "

That last one is about 9 months old. It says Redcat doesn't actually make that product. It's made by a third party who ONLY sells it to other companies who then resell it to the public as their own product. Both Redcat and HPI buy this from the same company, probablly with their own stickers already on it, and then sell it to the public. How can it be a clone if the guys who make it are getting paid? The whole arguement here is with the illegal sales of copywritten products, and the items you complain about do not fit this arguement. They are legitimate copies, not outright theft as you claim they are. It is perfectly legal to copy copywritten products IF you have an agreement with the people who have the copyright. Next you'll claim Caroll Shelby was a clone manufacturer.:lol:

I personally have nothing against the people who run clones, except that there aren't any around here who've met up with me for some fun. I can't hold that against them because none of the HPI owners have come out to play either.
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Well what really gets on my nerves is that the likes of yourself and lost in MN come on here with a handful of posts and rip everyone to pieces.PEOPLE WILL BUY WHAT THEY WANT NO MATTER WHAT!
Myself personally I couldn't give a toss if it were original or a copy.You stick to your stuff and we'll stick to ours!

And by the way ,I don't like Carol Shelby's cooking!!!!:mad:
J.
 
voo2doo said:
Well what really gets on my nerves is that the likes of yourself and lost in MN come on here with a handful of posts and rip everyone to pieces.PEOPLE WILL BUY WHAT THEY WANT NO MATTER WHAT!
Myself personally I couldn't give a toss if it were original or a copy.You stick to your stuff and we'll stick to ours!

And by the way ,I don't like Carol Shelby's cooking!!!!:mad:
J.
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Ah so your only concern is post count now huh? Since I don't have 6000 posts I have no clue what I'm talking about right?

You are a Mod here who should be setting an example for other people and not twisting threads into something they are not!

It's amazing to me that you as you put it you DON'T GIVE A TOSS.

NO ONE was harassing anyone in this thread besides you. WE were giving information about Counterfit Items on the market and you turned it into a CLONE debate. It's not up to you what information people should have.

I don't care what you think, I care about what people coming here seeking information think and the fact that they should be getting information that is accurate and not blown off because you DON'T GIVE A TOSS.

Some of us have added usefull information to this thread, you have done nothing but whine and complain and to deflect what the original topic was. That fact is more than clear by your comments.

Some of us have been affected by this situation and frankly it's disgusting to me that you obviously don't get it.
 
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